what welder to use

[Azzydot]

what can I use to weld a td04 flange to this pipe, mig with gas ? or tig weld which I don't have ? I just wana put down pipe so it's a full kit as its going soon,

 

[Enuo]

Same as before?

 

[Azzydot]

is it same as cast iron ? my mig might burn a hole in it? Or won't even weld,

 

[Enuo]

It's same as welding a flange to cast iron just angle torch away from the thinner metal...

 

[Azzydot]

Thanks I will do it like u said, just gas with normal wire ?

 

[Enuo]

Yeah, I'd get some practice in though as it's easy to go to steep with your angle and get no penetration or too shallow and punch a hole. Gas is a must for finer work like that, and you need to grind both work pieces so they are SPOTLESS. Ideally, you'd heat the cast material to red hot first as well to equalise the energy needed in both pieces to reach melting point, and iron based cast metals weld bettet when they are hot, especially if there is a higher carbon content. It's not stainless pipe is it?
Edit: just looked back at pic, normal wire should be fine.

 

[h701micra]

Well that pretty much sums it up Andy

 

[Enuo]

Welding cast iron (as opposed to steel) is something I've been exposed to alot when I worked at the railway (axle box lids, makers plates etc are often cracked). The same applies to cast steel, but you can be a little less careful as there are fewer impurities (I'd not welded cast steel until very recently and got some advice from some old boys first )

 

[h701micra]

Ah see cast iron I'd class as still fairly new to me. But having background welding knowledge helps

 

[Azzydot]

Yeah, I'd get some practice in though as it's easy to go to steep with your angle and get no penetration or too shallow and punch a hole. Gas is a must for finer work like that, and you need to grind both work pieces so they are SPOTLESS. Ideally, you'd heat the cast material to red hot first as well to equalise the energy needed in both pieces to reach melting point, and iron based cast metals weld bettet when they are hot, especially if there is a higher carbon content. It's not stainless pipe is it?
Edit: just looked back at pic, normal wire should be fine.

am not sure what steel it is, I bought it from scrappy I think it's off a tdi golf, I just need the 2.5 inch bend but yeh I'll have a practise on a spare and see what is best and I hope it don't burn a hole in lol, the td04 flange is mild steel defo ? can it combine as a good weld ? I have a mig gas wolf welder 140amp ?
but yes ur right only way is testing it and check? only problem now is how wil I weld or make a lamba sensor to fit that pipe ?

 

[Azzydot]

Ah see cast iron I'd class as still fairly new to me. But having background welding knowledge helps

I don't have much welding no no, only bought it to test and try, only done welding flanges on k11 flange and bits and bobs, can I do bad boy bonnet extension with a mig welder ? Without burning off cut metal it's gona be abt 3 to 5 mm thick ?

 

[h701micra]

Mig welders will weld anything steel
Tig is aluminium
Stick weld for everything else

 

[Azzydot]

Mig welders will weld anything steel
Tig is aluminium
Stick weld for everything else

I hear tig can cost so much to buy?

 

[h701micra]

So is a decent mig. Worth every penny if you like to fabricate things

 

[Azzydot]

how much can a starter price be something to get hang of? And for doing most things with ?

 

[karlj]

Mig welders will weld anything steel
Tig is aluminium
Stick weld for everything else

Stick is great once you get the hang of it, will do everything (with in reason) and I can get a tig attachment for mine

 

[Azzydot]

Stick is great once you get the hang of it, will do everything (with in reason) and I can get a tig attachment for mine

That does sound good, how much for a start guy for basic ? I mean everything I buy and learn ?

 

[Enuo]

You'll have to look at a few different machines/setups, read the reviews and decide what you need from there as far as buying TIG/Stick rigs is concerned, although you can be fairly sure you won't be needing water cooled machines!
The principles of stick and mig welding are pretty much the same, the difference being mig has auto feed and you manual feed stick. Stick can be used for much thicker metal. TIG is a bit different because you need to use both hands, one for torch to create and push around a weld pool in the metal and one for adding filler wire, but it all happens a lot more slowly and theres no sparking or spitting, it's very relaxed and you can take your time and get some beautiful welds. I would say of you want to go as far as TIG because you weld a lot of very thin metal or want show quality welds, go stick welding first and learn the hand control.
There are plenty of how to guides and youtube videos on the internet as well that will give you a good starting point for picking the various methods up.
If you've got the money though, nothing will beat tuition from a college, check out welding night classes at your local college, usually 12-20 weeks, £600-£900 and you get an industry recognised qualification to boot. Which if you're going to offer your welding services for a fee to other members you should have as a minimum.

 

[Azzydot]

You'll have to look at a few different machines/setups, read the reviews and decide what you need from there as far as buying TIG/Stick rigs is concerned, although you can be fairly sure you won't be needing water cooled machines!
The principles of stick and mig welding are pretty much the same, the difference being mig has auto feed and you manual feed stick. Stick can be used for much thicker metal. TIG is a bit different because you need to use both hands, one for torch to create and push around a weld pool in the metal and one for adding filler wire, but it all happens a lot more slowly and theres no sparking or spitting, it's very relaxed and you can take your time and get some beautiful welds. I would say of you want to go as far as TIG because you weld a lot of very thin metal or want show quality welds, go stick welding first and learn the hand control.
There are plenty of how to guides and youtube videos on the internet as well that will give you a good starting point for picking the various methods up.
If you've got the money though, nothing will beat tuition from a college, check out welding night classes at your local college, usually 12-20 weeks, £600-£900 and you get an industry recognised qualification to boot. Which if you're going to offer your welding services for a fee to other members you should have as a minimum.

Thanks for info, I really like the idea of tig it's a foot on pedal till it gets hot and pool the stick in the weld, and with stick my hands will shake lol and spark things up fast, I have looked on YouTube many times but I never got the idea of prices and so on, but I'll look and see my needs thanks

 

[l_jonez]

For the above i'd use stick welder with rods designed for dissimilar metals

 

[Azzydot]

For the above i'd use stick welder with rods designed for dissimilar metals

am into manifold cut and weld, and thin metal welding? Will that be ok

 

[h701micra]

Migs xan be used for dissimilar metals too its down to wire choice and gas

 

[Azzydot]

Migs xan be used for dissimilar metals too its down to wire choice and gas

can I mig thin metal with diffrent wire weld and keeping it in angle abt 12 mm away ?

 

[h701micra]

That's normally how they work

 

[h701micra]

Thinner material is less amps. Fine tune with wire speed.
Also use thinner wire. Ie 0.6mm

 

[Azzydot]

Thinner material is less amps. Fine tune with wire speed.
Also use thinner wire. Ie 0.6mm

I have used setting from 1 to 6 which I used 1 for thin metal welding and still burn holes wire was 0.6

 

[h701micra]

Use less amps.. or move your torch further away.. or move faster
Without seeing you weld or your welder its hard to advise

 

[Enuo]

Welding involves a lot of learning your kit and working around its flaws and playing to its strengths, no two rigs are exactly the same...

 

[h701micra]

I know my welders a pain with different thickness material. But it is phenomenal on gas flow and high penetration. Exactly the same welder next door requires more amps than me to do the same job... but its alot smoother on different materials.

Its either you or your welder and without the knowledge you can never be sure

 

[Azzydot]

I know my welders a pain with different thickness material. But it is phenomenal on gas flow and high penetration. Exactly the same welder next door requires more amps than me to do the same job... but its alot smoother on different materials.

Its either you or your welder and without the knowledge you can never be sure

I have tired on a cast iron and works well nice weld too, and that is on low setting but soon as I try thin metal it melts, or holes with 1 press lol, yeh am gona practice more and more on just scrap and check diffrent settings and see what is best

 

[h701micra]

Turn your wire speed down?

 

[Azzydot]

Turn your wire speed down?

I done that and all happens is just pops and sparks lol

 

[h701micra]

Usually what welders do
Turn your gas up if its popping that much. Move your torch away slightly. Its all technique

 

[Azzydot]

ok if I had gaps around td04 flange it's 2.5 inch hole and pipe is abt 2.3inch how will I cover that mm ? I know welder wont fill it, can I buy thin metal to cut around it or off cut ?

 

[Enuo]

Maybe a shallower torch angle as well? Less penetration that way but you need your feed right down or you just end up laying pigeon **** on top!

 

[Azzydot]

Usually what welders do
Turn your gas up if its popping that much. Move your torch away slightly. Its all technique

Ahhhh I haven't tryed that, might be to turn gas up and check I'll try it tommow thank

 

[Azzydot]

Maybe a shallower torch angle as well? Less penetration that way but you need your feed right down or you just end up laying pigeon #### on top!

Haha I don't want no spots all over the pipe lol, I'll try your way

 

[Enuo]

Haha I don't want no spots all over the pipe lol, I'll try your way

Try other Andy's advice first though, he's got a LOT more mig experience than I do (I do more TIG and a little bit of stick for chunky stuff)

 

[h701micra]

Andys and welders eh.

 

[Azzydot]

Which Andy is that then? Or maybe u can do my tig welding eh

 

[Enuo]

H701 and I are both called Andy. But H701 does MIG, I do TIG. The TIG welder I use is the work one, so the time I get on it is sporadic at best, and I'm based in Bristol which is probably miles from you... to be honest I think you could do it with your welder, you just need to get a sweet spot with the feed/current and then focus on getting your angles and travel speed right

 

[Azzydot]

Ohh ok, I know now for next time, I will try settings and gas diffrent settings see what happens I will try 2 hours on spare scrap, thanks for ur help, also why don't stick use gas and it's very strong ? And why is gasless mig so weak?

 

[Enuo]

Ohh ok, I know now for next time, I will try settings and gas diffrent settings see what happens I will try 2 hours on spare scrap, thanks for ur help, also why don't stick use gas and it's very strong ? And why is gasless mig so weak?

Stick welds are covered in a flux material that when it burns gives off a gas that shields the weld, it's 'strong' because it's a much thicker filler material so you can use much higher currents and get much better penetration (very loosely). Gasless mig exposes the weld pool to a) oxygen which causes corrosion (rust is iron oxide after all) and b) helium, which disolves in molten steel, then as the weld pool cools it is no longer soluble in the metal and leaches out forming little bubbles (porosity) which have no strength, so your weld looks like an aero bar.

 

[Azzydot]

Stick welds are covered in a flux material that when it burns gives off a gas that shields the weld, it's 'strong' because it's a much thicker filler material so you can use much higher currents and get much better penetration (very loosely). Gasless mig exposes the weld pool to a) oxygen which causes corrosion (rust is iron oxide after all) and b) helium, which disolves in molten steel, then as the weld pool cools it is no longer soluble in the metal and leaches out forming little bubbles (porosity) which have no strength, so your weld looks like an aero bar.

thanks for info and what will u say is gd in them both ?

 

[Enuo]

Stick is gasless so is more portable, you can get 1mm rods for it so you can go down to about a 1.2mm thick material you can weld with it, but it's much better at welding thicker pieces of metal together. Your weld length is also limited by the length of your rod. MIG wire goes down to 0.6mm usually (and can get thinner I believe) so is better for thinner stuff, and because you can get meters and meters of wire on one roll you can do very long continuous welds with it. Being auto feed it takes a lot of the guess work out of feeding the material in so a novice can get much better consistency. It's best with gas, and if you use large bottles it becomes less portable, and because the feed will keep going even if you stop moving the torch the machine dictates more of what you do.
It's important to remember that all the forms of welding there are have a time and a place and each have there merits, there is no 'best welding machine'.

 

[Enuo]

Also, with 3 car batteries, jump leads and a length of metal wire from a fence you can bodge together a fairly usable stick welder for emergency use, seen that done before!

 

[r-reg-sr]

dont forget eye safety

 

[Azzydot]

Also, with 3 car batteries, jump leads and a length of metal wire from a fence you can bodge together a fairly usable stick welder for emergency use, seen that done before!

Yes I like both idea stick and mig suits all types of work I guess so I'll give mig a go tommow and see how it gues

 

[Azzydot]

dont forget eye safety

I bought that first and I take it off last cost me 45 pounds from machine marts

 

[Enuo]

dont forget eye safety

Yes, OMG how much easier life is with an auto dimming mask... literally greatest thing ever. First 4 months of my welding training I used a solid one until I found out the other apprentices had self dimming ones in their booths and I complained... NEVER going back to solid. I'll risk arc eye before I go back. That much better.