need gearbox or clutxh help guys
- Thread starter k11john
- Start date
Hi, sorry for hijacking this thread. My other micra's all gears are stiff now. It won't let me to change gears when it's running. Only when I off this Micra then it will let me to change these gears.
Is it sound like this gearbox is worn out or need to change new gear oil?
Cheers
Jk
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Is it sound like this gearbox is worn out or need to change new gear oil?
Cheers
Jk
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
pollyp
Club Member
if just the selector rod bushes were worn loose, you should still be able to engage 3rd/4th if the clutch was fully disengaged whilst running engine.
cos he can't select any gear at all whilst engines running, suggests that the clutch ain't disengaging. since it seems to be an old clutch and the beer can cable screw was almost all the way up fully tight suggests that either the clutch pedal resting heights too low, cable is very stretched or worst could be a bent/fractured clutch pedal bracket mount I once had caused by dry sticky cable.
cos he can't select any gear at all whilst engines running, suggests that the clutch ain't disengaging. since it seems to be an old clutch and the beer can cable screw was almost all the way up fully tight suggests that either the clutch pedal resting heights too low, cable is very stretched or worst could be a bent/fractured clutch pedal bracket mount I once had caused by dry sticky cable.
Sorry guys, my phone was broken so I managed to get another phone. I managed to get this clutch cable out so I will upload pictures of this clutch cable in an hour time. ( I am out atm) I will need to do regrease this linkage and also gearstick ball tomorrow. Oh yea, will need to check rear mount so it was bouncing when these gears was changed around.
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Update. I think this oil is coming out from the top of Gearbox speedo. (It wasn't tight properly) Still it's not working so it won't let me to change these gears again. I think this clutch cable could be stretched. I called my mum to change these gears around so I looked at this beer cap hook on the top of gearbox. Only gear one is move but others are not move. Shall I get new clutch cable then?
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pollyp
Club Member
as well as stretched clutch cables, bent clutch pedal / clutch arm brackets, out of spec new clutches, worn loose selector linkages, another thing that could cause difficulty selecting gear whilst running are worn gearbox synchro clutches (unable to match gear speeds), worn synchro teeth (unable to slot into or engage the teeth) or worn gear selector forks (unable to move far enough to fully engage the gear).
found this useful video bout synchro's
found this useful video bout synchro's
pollyp
Club Member
I don't like how it's leaking that much gearbox oil, it ain't good and if the oil level gets too low, all the bearings/synchros/cogs start to get hot and irreversibly wear faster and whine etc.
has this gearbox been worked on or disturbed before by a garage? overfilled oil?
first thing imo is make sure there's enough gear oil inside. that looks like a 1L gearbox whereas I have a 1.3 but the way I check is remove the speedo pinion geear unit out the gearbox, and stick the engine dipstick in the hole till it hits the bottom and read the oil level same way as the engine oil.
if it's near max, refit the speedo.
I think you mentioned u once selected a gear whilst engine's stopped, clutch pedal fully down, crank engine and it lurches? that meant the clutch isn't fully disengaged.
try moving the beear cap adjuster to it's highest tightest shortest position on the clutch cable thread and see if it can disengage the clutch.
if it almost disengages the clutch, u could get afew mm more by moving this locknut all the way up, remove this rubber/metal cusion bit, put a washer between the locknut and the clutch cable bracket (to prevent the nut simply going through the big hole in the bracket), then u can tighten the beercap even higher.
if that doesn't work, car still lurches when starting in-gear with clutch disengaged or the pedal simply feels loose, then something in the clutch mechanism has broken.
has this gearbox been worked on or disturbed before by a garage? overfilled oil?
first thing imo is make sure there's enough gear oil inside. that looks like a 1L gearbox whereas I have a 1.3 but the way I check is remove the speedo pinion geear unit out the gearbox, and stick the engine dipstick in the hole till it hits the bottom and read the oil level same way as the engine oil.
if it's near max, refit the speedo.
I think you mentioned u once selected a gear whilst engine's stopped, clutch pedal fully down, crank engine and it lurches? that meant the clutch isn't fully disengaged.
try moving the beear cap adjuster to it's highest tightest shortest position on the clutch cable thread and see if it can disengage the clutch.
if it almost disengages the clutch, u could get afew mm more by moving this locknut all the way up, remove this rubber/metal cusion bit, put a washer between the locknut and the clutch cable bracket (to prevent the nut simply going through the big hole in the bracket), then u can tighten the beercap even higher.
if that doesn't work, car still lurches when starting in-gear with clutch disengaged or the pedal simply feels loose, then something in the clutch mechanism has broken.
Yea I know. I should check this gearbox oil before. This car was belong to old lady owner so she don't drive this car alot. This gearbox haven't been touched or worked by anyone. I didn't check gear oil level yet so will do it tomorrow.
Well, when this engine is on so it won't me to put gear one one (too hard and won't shift in). When this engine is off so I put the gear one on then started this engine. It was making crunching noise then juggling until the engine stopped.
I think it must be worn out gearbox. I will have a look on this gearbox oil level tomo. A good used gearbox is on the way tomorrow noon time. It looks I need to get 3 litre of gearbox oil and also maybe new clutch kit?
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Well, when this engine is on so it won't me to put gear one one (too hard and won't shift in). When this engine is off so I put the gear one on then started this engine. It was making crunching noise then juggling until the engine stopped.
I think it must be worn out gearbox. I will have a look on this gearbox oil level tomo. A good used gearbox is on the way tomorrow noon time. It looks I need to get 3 litre of gearbox oil and also maybe new clutch kit?
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pollyp
Club Member
the crunching juggling noise when starting in-gear, the clutch cable was also fully tight and pedal pressed down?
as mentioned in the vid, the reverse gear is non-synchromeshed so is useful in diagnosing if the problem is either clutch or gearbox.
so engine warm & idling, clutch fully tight & fully down for least 5sec to let gears a chance to slow down if disengaged, now try to select reverse gear.
if it grinds loudly and fails to select reverse, even when the cables fully tight, then it's definately clutch related.
if reverse slots in ok without grinding but unable to select forward gears, it's gearbox related.
whenever a gearbox is taking out and the clutch hasn't been touched within 1yr ago or it looks abit worn, it's always a good idea to replace the whole clutch while ur there.
imo from easiest cheapest option -> expensive:
1. if clutch wasn't fully disengaging and failed the reverse gear test mentioned above, replace & fix the clutch first.
check the clutch pedal box ain't deformed (could u photo the clutch pedal bracket mountings?)
separate gearbox from engine,
change clutch, also spot if the flywheels appears machined too much (excessive flywheel machining will also lower the bite point beyond the mechanisms travel range & prevent disengagement),
fit old gearbox back on briefly (just clutch cable fully tightened, selector linkage & starter motor. gear oil & driveshafts ain't essential cos we're just testing the clutch)
start engine and try to select reverse gear.
- if clutch is working it should stop grinding now. check if it selects forward gears. if it was the clutch then reassemble everything, topup oil and no need to fit new gearbox.
- if it still grinds in reverse then clutch is still not working, try replace cable. if still not working then part of the clutch system is really out of spec.
2. if clutch is now working after replacement, reverse doesn't grind but forward gears are blocked, then prob replace with the spare gearbox.
requires 3L of gear oil
as mentioned in the vid, the reverse gear is non-synchromeshed so is useful in diagnosing if the problem is either clutch or gearbox.
so engine warm & idling, clutch fully tight & fully down for least 5sec to let gears a chance to slow down if disengaged, now try to select reverse gear.
if it grinds loudly and fails to select reverse, even when the cables fully tight, then it's definately clutch related.
if reverse slots in ok without grinding but unable to select forward gears, it's gearbox related.
whenever a gearbox is taking out and the clutch hasn't been touched within 1yr ago or it looks abit worn, it's always a good idea to replace the whole clutch while ur there.
imo from easiest cheapest option -> expensive:
1. if clutch wasn't fully disengaging and failed the reverse gear test mentioned above, replace & fix the clutch first.
check the clutch pedal box ain't deformed (could u photo the clutch pedal bracket mountings?)
separate gearbox from engine,
change clutch, also spot if the flywheels appears machined too much (excessive flywheel machining will also lower the bite point beyond the mechanisms travel range & prevent disengagement),
fit old gearbox back on briefly (just clutch cable fully tightened, selector linkage & starter motor. gear oil & driveshafts ain't essential cos we're just testing the clutch)
start engine and try to select reverse gear.
- if clutch is working it should stop grinding now. check if it selects forward gears. if it was the clutch then reassemble everything, topup oil and no need to fit new gearbox.
- if it still grinds in reverse then clutch is still not working, try replace cable. if still not working then part of the clutch system is really out of spec.
2. if clutch is now working after replacement, reverse doesn't grind but forward gears are blocked, then prob replace with the spare gearbox.
requires 3L of gear oil
pollyp, post: 717407, member: 4527"]the crunching juggling noise when starting in-gear, the clutch cable was also fully tight and pedal pressed down?
Yes that is what i tried to say.
as mentioned in the vid, the reverse gear is non-synchromeshed so is useful in diagnosing if the problem is either clutch or gearbox.
so engine warm & idling, clutch fully tight & fully down for least 5sec to let gears a chance to slow down if disengaged, now try to select reverse gear.
if it grinds loudly and fails to select reverse, even when the cables fully tight, then it's definately clutch related. It is grind it so loud with fail to select reverse gear. other gears wont select as well.
if reverse slots in ok without grinding but unable to select forward gears, it's gearbox related.
whenever a gearbox is taking out and the clutch hasn't been touched within 1yr ago or it looks abit worn, it's always a good idea to replace the whole clutch while ur there. I didnt take this gearbox out since we bought this car last year. yea i know so i should look it before.
imo from easiest cheapest option -> expensive:
1. if clutch wasn't fully disengaging and failed the reverse gear test mentioned above, replace & fix the clutch first. That is happening now so is it worth to change new clutch now?
check the clutch pedal box ain't deformed (could u photo the clutch pedal bracket mountings?) I will take pictures now
separate gearbox from engine,
change clutch, also spot if the flywheels appears machined too much (excessive flywheel machining will also lower the bite point beyond the mechanisms travel range & prevent disengagement),
fit old gearbox back on briefly (just clutch cable fully tightened, selector linkage & starter motor. gear oil & driveshafts ain't essential cos we're just testing the clutch)
start engine and try to select reverse gear. ok i am going to do it now
- if clutch is working it should stop grinding now. check if it selects forward gears. if it was the clutch then reassemble everything, topup oil and no need to fit new gearbox.
- if it still grinds in reverse then clutch is still not working, try replace cable. if still not working then part of the clutch system is really out of spec.
2. if clutch is now working after replacement, reverse doesn't grind but forward gears are blocked, then prob replace with the spare gearbox.
requires 3L of gear oil
i will have a look on gearbox oil level now so i will report back to u soon. cheers jk
Yes that is what i tried to say.
as mentioned in the vid, the reverse gear is non-synchromeshed so is useful in diagnosing if the problem is either clutch or gearbox.
so engine warm & idling, clutch fully tight & fully down for least 5sec to let gears a chance to slow down if disengaged, now try to select reverse gear.
if it grinds loudly and fails to select reverse, even when the cables fully tight, then it's definately clutch related. It is grind it so loud with fail to select reverse gear. other gears wont select as well.
if reverse slots in ok without grinding but unable to select forward gears, it's gearbox related.
whenever a gearbox is taking out and the clutch hasn't been touched within 1yr ago or it looks abit worn, it's always a good idea to replace the whole clutch while ur there. I didnt take this gearbox out since we bought this car last year. yea i know so i should look it before.
imo from easiest cheapest option -> expensive:
1. if clutch wasn't fully disengaging and failed the reverse gear test mentioned above, replace & fix the clutch first. That is happening now so is it worth to change new clutch now?
check the clutch pedal box ain't deformed (could u photo the clutch pedal bracket mountings?) I will take pictures now
separate gearbox from engine,
change clutch, also spot if the flywheels appears machined too much (excessive flywheel machining will also lower the bite point beyond the mechanisms travel range & prevent disengagement),
fit old gearbox back on briefly (just clutch cable fully tightened, selector linkage & starter motor. gear oil & driveshafts ain't essential cos we're just testing the clutch)
start engine and try to select reverse gear. ok i am going to do it now
- if clutch is working it should stop grinding now. check if it selects forward gears. if it was the clutch then reassemble everything, topup oil and no need to fit new gearbox.
- if it still grinds in reverse then clutch is still not working, try replace cable. if still not working then part of the clutch system is really out of spec.
2. if clutch is now working after replacement, reverse doesn't grind but forward gears are blocked, then prob replace with the spare gearbox.
requires 3L of gear oil
i will have a look on gearbox oil level now so i will report back to u soon. cheers jk
pollyp
Club Member
clutch plate looks pretty new n thick, can still see the groove edge.
I was looking at the pedal bracket and spotted this low bit where it attaches to the bulkhead
I dunno if it's the thickness of the soundproofing that's blocking the view,
on a normal manual gearbox chassis (like on my first blue K11) there's this 10mm spacer bracket that's formed on the chassis to space the clutch bracket 10mm away from the bulkhead surface.
now on my current grey K11 it was originally auto, then converted to manual and the ppl forgot bout this spacer and it made the bite point feel really low etc cos this spacing really affects the clutch cable mechanism geometry.
I fitted some diy spacers
to space it out and fixed the issue
try remove ur clutch bracket n check if there's some form of spacer there?
I was looking at the pedal bracket and spotted this low bit where it attaches to the bulkhead
I dunno if it's the thickness of the soundproofing that's blocking the view,
on a normal manual gearbox chassis (like on my first blue K11) there's this 10mm spacer bracket that's formed on the chassis to space the clutch bracket 10mm away from the bulkhead surface.
now on my current grey K11 it was originally auto, then converted to manual and the ppl forgot bout this spacer and it made the bite point feel really low etc cos this spacing really affects the clutch cable mechanism geometry.
I fitted some diy spacers
to space it out and fixed the issue
try remove ur clutch bracket n check if there's some form of spacer there?
pollyp
Club Member
It's exactly two litres of gear oil so shall I put it back the top up up to 3l. My mate is on the way to drop 3l of comma 80/90 gl-4 gear oil.
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looking at haynes, the RS5F41A gearbox fitted on 1L models require an oil level (bottom of speedo hole to oil level) of 28-38mm whilst all other bigger gearboxes such as my 1.3 box require 45-54mm
pollyp
Club Member
let's resolve the clutch side first before touching the gearbox side.
check pedal bracket spacer, if intact the cable could be stretch..replace n test again
after fixing clutch & gearbox, look at the gear oil, if it looks manky dirty and ur getting new oil, may as well change oil.
check pedal bracket spacer, if intact the cable could be stretch..replace n test again
after fixing clutch & gearbox, look at the gear oil, if it looks manky dirty and ur getting new oil, may as well change oil.
