it involves a hole load of creeping
maybe eng fuse like stani's problem?
lol
well i don't think it can be a fuse otherwise the engine would not start at all.. but i have checked all the fuses and they are fine.
So it's not starting when you turn the key? But if you put it in gear and turn the key it does?
no it just doesn't start on the key no matter what.
maybe try turn to key to Start while a helper connects the starter to the seperate battery so during cranking, the ecu is given a signal that ur cranking (guessing maybe it makes the ecu adjust its starting mixtures according to its cranking map?)
but thats where its not working, if the key is in the ON position then it will bump start fine, if the key is in the start position so the starter is going round, it wont fire, i haven't tried bump starting it whilst turning the key but i think that might break something
Id say its a duff ignition switch, when the switch is in ignition on mode and you bump start it it goes fine, but wont start on the starter,
Id bet that when your turning the starter using the key the ignition is going off and not allowing the car to start. I would take out the ignition switch and run a permanent feed to the wire to keep the ignition turned on then try start it with the key
thats what i thought, but when the ignition is in the ON position (the same position that it is in when it bump starts and runs fine) and i manually start the starter motor by connecting it directly to another battery, it doesn't start, so the key position doesn't change.
he has duff'd it turning it too much :grinning:
lol maybe, this car has spent more time driving on its starter and bumping than actually driving.
i think he said he tried powering the starter with the key on IGN mode and didn't fire but yet it did fire when he bump started with key in IGN mode.
am I right Nex that you tried the seperate starter battery with the key on IGN mode with dash lights on?
yea exactly, and with the second battery doing just the starter motor, the lights didn't dim like they do when you normally crank a car, because it had all the power it needed.
see prehaps to test the ignition switch try sorta hotwiring it!
could tell you its the ign switch without ripping it apart
i have hotwired it, but it has had two ignition switches in its time, but either way the ignition switch doesn't change, i just leave it in the on position and either start the car by rolling it down a hill or try and start it by forcing the starter to run manually with a second battery.
Hmmm sounds nearly like the same problem as my Fiat Marea if i do not let the injection cycle run, possibly blaming it on a faulty stepper/idle motor as i can sometimes get it firing by throttle blipping however it doesn't idle correctly, only idle at 100-200 rpm (No idea how) and then picks up only if i drive it for a while or it decides to snap out of it!
But yours seems like the starter motor is turning the engine fine but everything else is completely ignoring it!
, can you tell if sparks are going or theres petrol/diesel whatever it is being fed correctly?
I'd say re-assemble the system back to stock, ignition and all,
Then i think you should if your volvo allows it, put the key in and run the starter immediately (Dont even wait for dashboard electronics) and fire her up, i'm guessing it'l turn over but not fire up, so try blip the throttle to see if you can get it going at all, and then if it doesnt start, i'd try let a full injection cycle occur and see if it'l turn over, i'd also take your plugs out and check the condition again since you've been turning it over with no success!
Good luck, this is an interesting thread!
Friend told me it could be a cheaply made starter with a damaged tooth? not sure if that makes any sence.
thanks for that, i will give it a try,
the car has all the things i needs, spark, compression, injector signal etc. but i am going to double check again, i think i want to wire something directly to the injector connector to see if it works, because all i got was a blip from my multimeter to say there was a signal, but it didn't say it was good enough to fully open the injectors,
but yea i think you are right, some how the car knows that it is being turned over by the motor and then decides to cut the fuel (fuel pump is running, and there is spark, but maybe no injectors) but why it would do this or how it knows is beyond me.
bliping the throttle doesn't work because it does not fire at all, the engine sounds like its going round with no HT leads on or with an immobilizer on (not that it has any at all) because it just goes round and round without stuttering like it does when it fires once or twice. so with the throttle open or closed it doesn't fire because something is not there,
its like the ECU is not opening the injectors enough or something... when its running i can remove the air mass sensor and it still runs, i can also disconnect a positive feed which goes somewhere to the engine, both of these things cause it to run rough but still run,
as for the starter, i am 100% sure the starter is fine, i drove it up a hill in reverse by putting it in gear and just turning the key, it drove up the hill no problems, then i rolled it back down and gave it a bump and it started. the starter is amazingly strong, it will move the car in any gear, and the battery will power the motor for about a minute constantly, before starting to die.
anyway thanks again for the help guys, i have got some great ideas about what to try next, i am starting to lean towards something with the transmission, as it has a 4 speed gearbox with an electric 5th gear overdrive, when in 5th there is a little light but taking it out of gear in to neutral the light goes out. so the ECU knows if its in gear or not, and i wonder if it is choosing not to start the engine if its not in gear and the clutch is down.... or something
