Golf TDi Vs Micra + large bet

CMF_spagatoni

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I live in the UK where people tend to take the p*** out of Micras. Anyway, since telling my workmates what i intend to do to my car, i've had alot of "Uh?", and "What's the point?" etc, etc. I told the TDi driver that i reckon i could beat him from a standing start (at the lights to be more precise) once the alterations are made. He laughed and bet me £100 - seriously, handshakes and witnesses!

This will be the match:

Standard 1.9 Golf TDi - 90bhp and lots of torque

V

K11 1.3(still 1.0 at the moment) with full s/s exhaust, Janspeed manifold, Jun flywheel, K&N panel filter and whatever cams you guys could recommend.

All the guys at work think the Golf will win. This will go down in my companies history if i win.

Can i do it?
 

CMF_Pyro

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I dont know to much about these matters, but maybe you could have asked this question before you placed your bet :) Just a thought...
 

CMF_Urban

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I would have to say the micra would win.

My sister owns a VW Golf, 2.0L and i can beat it in the micra for a good while.

And my micra is stock engine and drive train.

Good luck with the race! Show them how micra's do it. ^_^
 

CMF_spagatoni

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I think his is 2000/01, he told me it is 90bhp so i hope he's right.

He really doesn't believe the micra can win - and neither do alot of the other guys. The look on his face should be so good i'll have to post it here!

Reckon i'll get the car sorted by the new year.

Just one more thing, those cams on the datrats site, are they plug and play or do i need anything extra to go with them?

 

CMF_NotAnotherSSS

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If he gives that little golf a bit more boost - you could be in quite a situation.

Those little golfs can make some serious torque.

I had a new model TDI golf almost make mince meat out of me the other day. IT was an auto too.

Hurry up and get the 1.3L!!
 

CMF_carlos_fergando

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also with such less difference between the two, it would be ESSENTIAL to get a good launch and good gearchange!

if not then chances are slim, a TDi can still do quite well with not to bad gearchange.

I would practice launching! it tooks me ages to perfect it in the micra, but no im great at it.

bad launch and its all over!
 

CMF_White Knight

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Apart from engine mods I have found the best thing to help you off the mark is the short shifter mod.
I always seemed to struggle between 1st and 2nd with the standard set up at times if you did not nail it right.

 

CMF_li'l missy

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just to give you an idea of what you are up against....

all of VW's turbo diesel powered vehicles have better performance figures than their petrol counterparts when talking in terms of straight line speed that is.

i know a few ppl in the VW buisness and most of them have the t/d's as their 'fast' cars, so watch out...
 

CMF_Napster

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with the 1.3 and all the mods moved over from this car(or engine transplant)i think it will be close. im not sure who will win, im hopeing u in ur micra of course, but i would like to know the result(like everyone else lol)

when is this race planned??

cheers
Napster
 

CMF_Napster

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i just read the 1st post, and about all the mods u will have on the 1.3

with the lightened flywheel, im sure u will win.

my mate had the 1.3, with induction kit, janspeend manifold, exhaust, jun flywheel, nismo alloys, stripped interia apart from two bucket seats. his 0-60 time was "7-something seconds" (closer to 8 seconds, remembering correctly)

it was one nippy beast lol

Napster
 

cisco

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I'm sure the mighty micra will win with all those mods.

Make sure you remove all the weight that he can't see (spare tyre, jack, parcel tray) that will give you another advantage. Also make sure you run small and efficient/light wheels/tyres. Ideally 13s with only 165 wide tyres on them at the max. more tyre will give you a better launch, but you will suffer in 2nd gear and above.. Wheels/tyres make a HUGE difference.

Make sure your intake is designed very well. Filter right behind the grill, one simple straight direct path straight to the throttle body. No terrible K&N 57i crap.

Get in there!
 

CMF_spagatoni

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Well, the money is in the bank, the mechanic is standing by, flywheel, clutch and manifold are about to be ordered and i'm going to look at 25000mile engine tommorrow. As for the air intake, i was gonna just throw a K&N panel in the box -(or a nismo one i've seen) but maybe i should put more thought into that if its going to make that much of a difference.

I'd love this to happen before christmas, but it would probably be fair to say early next year - Janurary sometime. Iw ant to make extra sure of this so i won't do it untill i've put all the mods i can afford in it.

By the way, i'm not modding the car just to beat the Golf - the bet has just sped everything up!
 

CMF_Napster

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with the mods that are going onto the micra, would anyone estimate a "BHp"???

i think (im so going to be wrong) with those on it would be about 125BHP (please forgive me if im SOOOO wrong lol)

i would say that the micra is lighter than the TDI, but that doesnt matter that much if the TDI has more Torque, or does it??

Napster
 

CMF_w8upforme

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You'd def need other pistons to reach 125 bhp on an n/a 1.3 engine, just manifold cams exhaust and different intake won't do to raise the bhp that much.
bigger compression ratio is what you want.

My mate has 102bhp corrected power output on his 1.3 micra,
(at the flywheel), only really limiting power at this point is de revlimiter, if that will be raised, he could be seeing about 120bhp at the flywheel, don't know how much that is at the wheels as haven't seen his Dyno yet..
 

CMF_Polar

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i dont think pistons are needed to see 125bhp. 115bhp has been had from na tune 1.3 with standard cams. race cams with new remap and extra fuel should see an extra 10bhp.
the 1.3 could do with an increase in compression though. can also get uprated thinner gasket (a little cheaper to do) or skim the head (a lot cheaper) to acheive this if budget cant afford the pistons. i am aiming for 130ps with standard pistons.
 

CMF_Napster

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im confused (sorry).

so a none tuned 1.3 can get 115bhp??

standard its about 75bhp isnt it? (maybe wrong)

so that increased bhp must have come from somewhere, guessin "flywheel, induction kit, S/s exhaust system"???

Yes, or completly wrong??

Napster
 

CMF_spagatoni

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From what i understand of the flywheel, i should get quicker response but a reduction in torque. The Golf's torque seems to be quite an issue.

So, the flywheel is definately going in at some point, but with a 95-100ish BHp Micra (with or w/out Fwheel) against a heavier 90BHp Golf, could the flywheel actually let me down over the distance of 1/4 mile say?
 

CMF_Polar

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i feel importance of torque (low down rpm) is overrated. its not that important compared to a more revy setup when proper racing is concerned. this kind of torque is good for normal use and from pulling to one speed to another at low rpm. but if its in a situation in racing when your already in the power band and on the way to screaming to the limiter, having the speed of a light weight flywheel is much more important. and makes you faster. having more torque would be good, but not in they way of having a heavy flywheel. it should come from the engine power itself.
 

CMF_spagatoni

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I seeee. Thanks people. If this works, and i flippin well hope it does, i will be v gratefull to you all. And, of course, i'll let you know how it goes!

If i lose, you'll probably next see me asking lots of questions about turbos!
 

CMF_55bhp is more than enough

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in general yes bhp is for bragging rights and torque actually gets u down the road but with a micra weighing about as much as a golf tdi's indicator stalk, torque isnt that much of an issue. however with the golf being as big as a house and weighing as much, more torque is needed for the same result. i reckon you would take the 90bhp version in standard form no problem, but when u get to the gti red with 130 bhp and feck loads of torque you might need more upgrades
 

CMF_NISMO

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if its deffinatley a 90 bhp tdi and not the 130 or 150 bhp, then i deffinatley think you can do it,an your right about people in the uk giving the micra a hard time, they don't know how good a car it is!!!!
 

CMF_Ghetto Micra

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everyone here seems pretty confident the Micra will win.

I actually think, if the Golf driver can drive...

the Golf may actually win.

I got my doors blown off by a landcruiser a month ago at a set of lights... no kidding! my micra is standard, but still, what an eye opener! hahaha
 

CMF_Polar

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you seem pretty pesimistic. even if it was the 150bhp golf GT tdi. the micra would still win from a standing start. certainly the 0-60 of the 150bhp tdi is a slow 8.3 seconds. i have 105-110bhp worth of tuning (standard flywheel and cams) and lightweight k11 and can do it in a g-tech time of low 7's average.
 

CMF_NotAnotherSSS

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No i think ghtto is being realistic.

Modern turbo diesels have craploads of torque.

If the golf driver knows how to drive his oil burner (ie: keep it at max torque) and his gearbox can keep up with the gearchanges required - the little micra is probably going to be left screaming its poor tits off in the diesel fumed wake of a Golf...
 

CMF_Polar

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how can you say a micra that would be in in the 6.x seconds area 0-60mph when the mods are finished be beaten off the line by a golf tdi that even if its the 150bhp GT version, does 0-60mph in 8.3?

 

CMF_spagatoni

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I was starting to feel some pre-race smugness untill the last few posts, now i'm getting a little nervous!

This could be happening sooner than i suggested as well. I didn't realise how quick the parts i ordered would take to arrive. The manifold came last week, and the flywheel today!

----Quick note about the Flywheel---- If anyone else is thinking of getting one from Japan, make sure you've got £36 on you when it arrives at your door. Flippin Customs charge VAT and a clearance fee! You have to pay the guy who delivers it to you or you dont get it!

Its all being fitted next Wednesday.

There is one small query i have...Did try to find another thread about it but couldn't...Anyway, the engine i bought doesn't have its tb - will mine be okay for now, or do i have to have the 1.3?

(i'm not going to do the race untill i know i'll beat him!)
 

CMF_NotAnotherSSS

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Not race until you know you'll beat him!?!?! Bah I'd give him a run with the 1.0L and all those mods. Just to shove **** in his face and rub it into his nose (and eyes) if you win!

Hehe.

Polar - I've had a play with one of the higher ranking CG13DE's on this forum (Matty aka no_jammn'/catspew whatever the hell his name is) which picked over 50kW at the front wheels at a dyno day. First hand experience with these turbo diesel golfs and 307s tell me that a K11 with the same sort of power that little jammin' has is going to have a very hard time staying ahead of the golf.

I'm still on the fence as to who will come out ontop because I think it'll be pretty even.

spagatoni - make sure you get a heavy duty clutch fitted as well. IF you cant find them over there, import one! To get this golf off the line you're going to have launch HARD. If you bog down in the slightest you can kiss your money goodbye i reckon.

Also invest in a short shifter. Not just a hack the top off the current one, but a proper short shifter. There are DIY's on this website or you can buy them on Ebay. You should seriously look into getting some lightened drive belt pulleys as well... Mabye shoot an email to Errol at Datrats about this.

Spare tyre, try and find a SPACE SAVER from a Sunny GTiR. Don't go out driving without your jack and spare tyre and tyre iron. Very silly thing to do.

Seats - the bottom foams are light enough but check the rear seat back. This is probably the heavy part because it has a steel frame. You should look into getting the frame rebuilt with aluminium.... Will be lighter and an undetectable mod to the authorities. I dont see why it could be a dangerous thing to do if you spend the money on decent grade aluminium.

Thats about all i can think of at the moment...
 

CMF_55bhp is more than enough

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its simple u with 75bhp in standard trim weighing about 800kg ish and the golf with 90 bhp and weighing over a ton. i know first hand that u can beat a 1.9tdi 90 bhp golf. you have nothing to worry bout. even if he beats u off the line as soon as he changes gear at about 4500rpm you can still go up to bout 6000rpm. trust me ive raced lots of diesels and as soon as u get up about 3000rpm ur away. yeah the diesels got low end touque but it needs to change gear quicker. u have a 16 valve engne that wen it get above 3000rpm shoots off. as long as he has 90bhp YOU WILL WIN. make sure u gloat afterwards for me!!!!
 

CMF_UK-micra

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I have a 1.0 engine and i won a race with a 1.8d escort and a 1.3 corsa. Your gona win hands down if you mod your car. Just look out for speed cameras. The police are out more now in my area because we have grate long roads ideal for racing.
 

CMF_Urban

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Well today i was driving in town to pick my sister up from Careers College (Which i do every single weekday) in her 2.0l VW Golf (Which I usually have to drive seems as though my other sister always drives the micra!! *angry face* ANYWAYS...

I was think about the micra, and whether or not it's really feasible to go N/A with it... Then i ended up pulling up behind another P plater, in a Black GTI Golf... He was a real *&^#^&@ and sat there reving his engine and jumping forward (This was directed at me, because as soon as he saw I was another P plater in a Golf... Hormones kicked in for him). Anyways, He shot off like a rocket and i just putted along... And then i knew i was DEFINATELY going to do the micra up...

I just want to see the look on his face when a 1.3l Micra eats him...

Well, I just thought i'd let off some steam... lol.

But now i'm quite happy... Thanks to him the micra is a no brainer. >:)
 

cisco

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You can't beat it. That's the whole point of a fast micra.
"shift expectation" hah
 
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