Ethanol conversion

[CMF_Grev]

Does anybody know much about ethanol conversions for petrol cars? I've dabbled a bit in bio-diesel with SVO and WVO but I have no idea about ethanol conversions for cars, I'm after at least E85 to pure ethanol conversions and wondering what needs to be changed within the engine etc?

Would be great if an expert comes to my aid.

 

[CMF_mycra]

e85 thats 108octane race fuel...as oppose to k11 tuned on 91 or 95 i think...you must adjustable timing gears, get ur valve lift right, run high compression(or a waste) and tuned according....pretty much rebuild the lot to suit.

e85 has cooler intake charge and high stability, excellent for race application and turbo. thus less efficiency for daily. achieves average 10-20% increase though ...and only a few caltex have e85(in victoria i know of). if you run out then stuck, if you put petrol in you'll blow the motor.

if power you're after, that power difference can easily achieved with forced induction on 3-5psi

 

[CMF_Grev]

I'm always thinking of crazy stuff so I'm just thinking of using it daily and not for turboing or anything, and I have not seen E85 being sold here in Brisbane at all so I'm thinking of distilling it myself... hahaha

 

[CMF_mycra]

lol for daily might as well go LPG..ask frank, he was tracking the k11 and on 8000rpm no limiter

 

[CMF_Grev]

With ethanol or LPG?

 

[CMF_mycra]

LPG, apparently the ecu self disables the rev limiter

 

[CMF_Grev]

Hmmm so from sources of info, turbo ethanol seems quite efficient, maybe that route would be better than non turbo ethanol?

 

[CMF_mycra]

yeah most proper drift cars i watched getting built all end up running e85/108 oct. its good for n/a too... its mostly inefficient because of mpg, as to the motor its self prob better due to less heat and stability...

 

[CMF_Grev]

mycra WROTE:

"yeah most proper drift cars i watched getting built all end up running e85/108 oct. its good for n/a too... its mostly inefficient because of mpg, as to the motor its self prob better due to less heat and stability...

But need to becareful of it corroding the internal components... :s haha

 

[CMF_DECIM8]

You drink about 10x the fuel, you can turn the timing up heaps too! power!

Check out skylinesaustralia.com for more info.

 

[CMF_knotan]

here in sweden we have used e85 (108 octane) for tuned engines about 10 years now,

there were (and still are) many people talking about all the bad stuff with e85, but personally i havent noticed much of it.

on a NA engine you will get very little effect

higher compression and higher ignition advance will get a stronger engine in low/mid range, but will not make a big diffrence in topend power.

you need to increase the fuel out of injectors about 20-30% (also be shure the fuelpump can deliver)

on turbo engines, the benefits are way much bigger.
the octane allows you to use much higher compression without loosing poower with knocking.
higher boost and higher compresson without the need to use lower timing advance.. much more effective engine....

the biggest probleme is the car is almost imossible to strat when outside tempretue falls below 0 degre C (about 5 months a year in sweden) but no big probleme for yopu guys.

the other problem is that it is a "dry" petrol, it Will make your fuelpump brake if not using some kind of extra lubricant, Redline Si alcohol will do the jobb perfect

 

[CMF_Grev]

Thanks knotan, if you have any more information, please do tell!

 

[CMF_knotan]

in sweden we have a kind of regulations on taxes,
since e85 is lokal produced and a bit more environment friendly fuel. e85 is a bit cheaper (at summer about 10skr for e85, or 15skr for 95 octane petrol)
in winters the petrol stations change to e75 to make car start easier when cold started.

1 aud is about 7.5 skr(Swedish kronor)

some people (including me) also use e85 in daily drivers to save money.

if you run a std engine on e85 you ca run (n/a engine) in lambda 1 constant, when a normal petrol engine would need more fuel at full throttle (probobly 0.9 lambda)

one other thing is that since pure ethanol is much less energetic, when using 100% ethanol (pure ethanol is not 100% , since there is always at least 1 % water) the fuel consumption will be to high , not making as musch power, that is why fuel stations mix in about 15% petrol to make a the car more fuel efficent... you can gain a little more power with pure ethanol, but it will cost a alot in litres/km

i can save about 2-3 skr per 10km with ...

that is in most cars 1litre/10km in 95 octane or 1.2litre/10km on e85.

if you have some a special question just tell and i will answer....

 

[CMF_Grev]

Do you know what the procedure is to fully convert the engine into using E85 or pure ethanol? And costs... :s I think I kind of dug myself a big hole here...

 

[CMF_DECIM8]

Bigger injectors, aftermarket ecu, Aftermarket fuel pump and lot of money. You will end up paying more for fuel.

Gas is a much cheaper option. Unless you get a turbo at the same time, then its worth it.

 

[CMF_plattsy]

Thread dig. Anyone manage it?

 

[CMF_Tony]

You can get e-flex from Castrol servo at Crestmead and the United on Johnson rd at Forestdale has had e85 available for afew weeks now. If I ever turbo a micra again I will only use e85.

 

[CMF_plattsy]

interested to know if anyone has turbod a micra and put it on e85 yet?!