Charlotte - Stuttering and Stalling

[CMF_daily_ricer]

This question is mainly for Yom,

I'm pretty sure Charlotte is experiencing the well known throttle body issue. She's stuttering quite a bit when both cruising and accelerating, and on more than one occiasion has stalled at idle. After searching the archives, this definately sounds familiar.

I have a second TB that littlebear passed onto me in preparation to fix this known issue with Charlotte, but that TB needs a good clean up. There is a bit of corrosion and dirt in some parts, so I am reluctant to use this for anything other than a last resort.

I am going to attempt the resoldering this weekend on the one that is currently on Charlotte, but I am pretty sure I remember Yom had already done this, or was going quite a while back. I know for sure that the current TB has been tampered with just by looking at it, there is red glue around the edges of the cover rather than the factory black rubber seal. Yom, did you resolder the TB? Did it fix what ever issue you were having?

SO if the current TB has already been resoldered, how likely is it that the connections have already come unstuck? By looking at the guide, it seems to only recomend resoldering the two rows of three joints that connect the plug to the board. Is there any harm in attempting to do all other visible connections? I have a solder sucker, so I am able to clean the old solder up completely and put new stuff on if need be.

I'd rather try getting the current one working at this stage, but if there are no improvements after the resolder, are there any other suggestions? I'll possibly get some contact cleaner and spray the connections on the plugs but I don't see that making much of a difference.

Any further advice would be great.

Tom

 

[CMF_Yom]

Yeh mate I pulled it open and had a look and reheated the solder already on the PCB. I saw some pretty messy soldering in there. Cleaned it up a bit i think... Was over a year ago now. So I wouldn't be suprised if it was back.

 

[CMF_daily_ricer]

Cool, thanks for the feedback Yom. When I pulled the panel off, there was a sticker in there somebody had put in with the date of the last resolder lol. It was November last year if I remember.

I tried the resoldering, but it does not appear to have done anything. Initially, I was expecting the car to idle with a higher rpm as mentioned in other threads here. But I didn't notice a difference so didn't bother adjusting the little screw on the corner closest to the driver’s side. I let her run for a couple mins while I stuffed my face with lunch, but after a while, noticed the little flutter in the rpm come back at idle before stalling about a minute later.

I tried resoldering again. This time instead of just re-heating the solder that was there, I tried my best to remove it and add some new stuff. Again it seemed to work. I took Charlotte for a spin and it definitely felt a lot better. I was gone for about 3 km testing all aspects of the RPM range ) and I was sure I fixed it. But as I came back into my street, and the engine had warmed up properly, I felt the stutter again, not as bad as it had been though.

My concern is now that I tried yet again. I'm an f'ing twit for this. After stuffing around and attempting to do it a third time, and plugging everything back together, it seemed to be worse than it ever was. After 3 attempts by myself, and Yom who did it earlier, I fear the heat from the solder iron has damaged some of the electrics in there. I played with the little screw to try and adjust the idle as it was sitting a bit low. I turned it anti-clockwise and didn't notice the rpm change at all, so I put it as best I could, back where it was.

The strange thing is, that after the third time with the air box off, and the wiring with the brown plug disconnected, it seemed to run ok. But by the time I had reconnected everything, and stuck the panel back on the side of the TB with silicone, everything had gone to **** the next time I started her. Charlotte will not idle smoothly; the rpm is all over the place for about 10-15 seconds before stalling each and every time.

I have the second TB still though. SO hopefully even with fathers day etc, parents etc coming around this arvo and haven't yet cleaned the house, I will have a chance today to get to REPCO or somewhere and get some carbie cleaner or maybe just some turps and a can of compressed air (they still sell that?) and give it a good clean and put that on. I am assuming I will need a new gasket even if I manage to remove the current TB with out damaging the gasket that is already there? Also, is there a specific torque setting for the bolts that hold the TB on?

Sorry for writing so much but, lastly, I do not think that the distributer has anything to do with it, as it looks brand new. I think littlebear actually said that Yom replaced it recently, but I know that Yom adjusted the timing slightly. Is it likely that by advancing the timing on Charlotte, this could be causing a problem and not TB?

I'm doing this all with the internet and micra.com.au as I do not have a manual very little previous mechanical knowledge past oil changes and flushing the radiator. Unfortunately my Dad had the idea with cars that "If you want something done properly, you're better off paying an expert" lol, so yeah, I missed out growing up. My fiancé’s uncle is a mechanic, so if worse comes to worse, he can have a look.

Again, any help this early in the morning would be great from anyone )

Thanks

 

[smidge]

if there's a history of trouble with the throttle body i would just assume its that and replace it

you can't just replace the AFM bit on these like other nissans i don't think

don't use turps, stick to carby cleaner thats what its made for

 

[CMF_littlebear]

The distributor was replaced by Yom with a brand new one a few days before I picked it up. If the Resoldering was done in Nov 07 then Yom must have done it just before I purchased it—I wasn't aware that it was done so close to me buying the car.

All your testing will hopefully confirm my buying the complete replacement unit. I am sure now that it is just a matter of replacing the unit. Fingers crossed the replacement one is ok—at least we know it hasn't had the re-soldering job done.

Torque setting for bolting down the TB is 24 Nm. Working diagonally. Manual says to replace the gasket but I'd see if the one on there could be salvaged first.

Good luck.

 

[CMF_Yom]

Yeh november sounds about right. I had a stab at it as it wasn't running to my standards. Seems it was actually the dizzy starting to fail... hah.

 

[CMF_daily_ricer]

littlebear, I remember you mentioning the distributer to me now. I didn't get a chance to attempt changing the TB on Sunday. Thanks for the tourque setting too!

After Saturday night when I started Charlotte for the final time that day, the idle was flipping all over the place, from 400rmp to 1.5-2k and back in an instant. I feared the worst.

Sunday morning after my post here, I went out to start her again and it all seemed normal. I went sprint auto and got everything I think I'll need to swap the TB. I.e. TB cleaner, and a spray can of AFM sensor cleaner "proven to gain 5-10hp at the wheels!" lol, and a pretty decent tourque wrench. I have a gasket on order just in case.

I'm pretty much having to build up all my tools from scratch. Since moving house last year, I've lost access to the stuff I used to easily borrow from friends down the street if it was anything outside a socket set or screw drivers.

Anyways, after a 30min round trip to sprint, Charlotte only stuttered twice on the way home. This morning on the way to work, she didn't do it even once. She is now idling a little higher than she used to before I tried the resolder, but the rpm is still around the 800-900 mark after warming up. It will be interesting to know how she goes one the way home tonight with the warmer ambient air. It's usually the warmer part of the day I've noticed the stutter to be worse, much like others have mentioned.

Either way I'm fully prepared now to swap the TB this weekend if need be. As frustrating as it is, I am actually enjoying spending my much needed money and time on something other than the mortgage and bills lol. It will be good when I can acutally spend it on something more performance orientated.

Thanks everyone for the help.

 

[CMF_Yom]

Spending money on that car was fun for me and strangley easy - and i'm a tightarse.

I got enjoyment out of pretty much everything.

Even though i only got a few days out of it - that dizzy replacement was amazing. made a huge difference to general driving and the fuel economy.

Definately sounds like that TB has to go.